Charis & Jim
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What if a routine preventative scan, one that you choose out of curiosity, not fear, changed everything? Not just your health, but the way you show up for your family, your work, and yourself. I know that so many of you listening have navigated a health journey. Whether it's your own diagnosis, a loved one's, or just that nagging feeling that something needs to change before something forces you to, this episode is for you.
Here's the reframe: Your body doesn't wait for a convenient time to get your attention. But how you respond, the habits you build, the mindset you bring, the way you take back even a small sense of control, that part is yours, and that's exactly what this podcast is about. Today, I have my most personal guest yet, my husband, Jimmy Sederberg.
Jimmy is a cardiac anesthesiologist here in Denver. And in May of twenty twenty-three, a routine calcium scan turned into the discovery of a rare thymic carcinoma tumor. [00:01:00] What followed was two surgeries, radiation, ongoing surveillance, and a complete reorientation of how he thinks about his health, his time, and what matters most.
In this conversation, we talk about what it really is like to be a healthcare professional on the other side of a scary diagnosis, how his daily habits have shift, what scan anxiety actually feels like from the inside, and what he'd say to anyone who has been handed news that they weren't expecting.
What I love about this conversation is that it's honest, it's real, and it happened over coffee, just like we do most every weekend. Let's get into it.
Welcome back to the Harness Your Health podcast. I have a very special guest here with us today my husband, Jimmy Cederberg, and we are going to talk about lots of juicy topics. But first of all, I just want to thank you for being here, and I have to say, this might have been one of the harder podcasts to schedule, if you will, [00:02:00] which is random since we're both in the same house right now with kids and dogs present, so hopefully it'll all go as planned.
Thank you for having me. Have been a great admirer for a long time of your work, So I started this podcast, I think I'm about eight episodes in and have definitely done some really great interviews.
And just in the process of talking about the podcast and sharing things with you, you mentioned that you would be a guest on my podcast. You also work in healthcare, and we're gonna talk about that. But there's Something important, I think, and maybe a message that we wanna talk about.
So we'll get into that in a little bit. And I should just say, we have a tradition on the weekends when you're home that we do coffee. So we're doing our coffee, We're enjoying our coffee together just in a very different way than we normally do. Yes, absolutely. So you grew up in Denver.
You're the oldest of six kids. Do you wanna talk about that a little bit? Was it a little bit crazy or? Sure. It's the only way that I ever knew, so I didn't know anything but the [00:03:00] craziness. I'm 16 years older than my youngest sister, so I had a lot of practice changing diapers, you know, kind of helping raise kids.
Big deal was that my sister was born a few months before I got my driver's license, so as soon as I got my driver's license, my parents were very happy 'cause I was able to run a lot of errands, drive carpool. Luckily, there weren't the rules there were now.
So I just kinda jumped in and was able to help out. But yeah, it's great. You know, We didn't always all get along, but now that we're all older, we get along a lot better. And when we see each other, it's really neat. And seeing our kids together too is really cool. Yeah. And it's pretty special that all of your siblings live in Colorado uh, within an hour or so of Denver.
Yeah, that wasn't by accident. My parents worked hard to make sure that happened. Yes, your mom- This was their goal was to have everybody in the same spot. Definitely. I think the funniest story about you turning 16 is when you turned 16, your mom showed up with car keys and a credit card. It was basically like, "You're my errand boy [00:04:00] now."
Yes. I ran a lot of errands, but I was happy to do it 'cause I had just started driving. Yeah. And we know intimately well. We have a 16-year-old, so While he doesn't have so many siblings, he's been pretty excited to run errands and do anything in the car for sure. He's been very helpful.
Definitely. Let's maybe talk just about how... I'll just say you're an anesthesiologist and your dad was an anesthesiologist. He's a retired anesthesiologist. So what did you do for college, and like, how did that even become a thing that you were interested in anesthesia? I think unlike probably almost everyone else on this planet, that's all I've ever wanted to do was be an anesthesiologist.
When I was six or seven years old, I saw my dad and saw how respected he was and that he loved his job, and he worked a lot, but he was home a lot too. And I said, " That's what I wanna be." So going to the pediatrician at seven or eight when she'd ask me, "What do you wanna do when you grow up?" I always said, "I wanna be an anesthesiologist like my dad."
So my whole education was kind of [00:05:00] centered around that and focused towards that. So in high school, in the summers, I got a job at the Health Sciences Center here in University of Colorado doing research and helping out with urology 'cause we had a friend, or actually a neighbor who was a urologist.
And then in college, I took all the classes for pre-med, all the, prerequisites you had to take. But I also thought I wanted to do something different, so I did a philosophy major, like ethical studies was my major with just taking all the classes to get into med school I didn't wanna just go the completely traditional route. And I took a few years off between undergrad and medical school. I did some really cool heart failure research that also helped point me towards cardiac anesthesia. Yeah, 'cause that really is your specialty, and right now that's all you're doing for the most part In theory.
In theory. Yeah. I know, I think, I don't know that I've known anyone that knew what they wanted to be when they were a little kid, and then that's what they've become, and that's what you'll retire doing, right? Yeah, definitely. I, I always-- It wasn't [00:06:00] even just to be an anesthesiologist. It was to be an anesthesiologist and work with my dad.
Yeah. So when I, as I was finishing my training, there was an opportunity to take a job at the VA, which is not where my dad worked. My dad worked in private practice here in town. Okay. And I thought, we have the exact same name. We're gonna have the exact same job, and I didn't wanna just jump right into the exact same practice as him.
So I took a year at the VA, and I think at first he was kinda not very happy that I made that choice, 'cause he also wanted me to be working with him, too. Yeah. But I think, it was the right thing to do, and it became clear during that year that, I had to follow my heart, and I always wanted to work with my dad.
So after that year at the VA, I left the VA and joined his group, where he was the president, and got to work with him for I think eight or nine years or so before he retired, which is pretty cool. And anesthesiologists don't, we don't ever really work together necessarily. We're in our own room doing our own cases.
But working with him, and I got to see him in the doctor's lounge, have coffee with him in the morning sometimes, have lunch with him. Yeah. I got to talk to him about stuff that was going on, about [00:07:00] difficult cases that I'd had, and he was really, he was an amazing mentor and dad, I guess.
Yeah. Everything you could ask for, and it was everything that I hoped it would be. Yeah. Your dad is just such a great guy. He's so well-loved and respected by I think everyone, whether it's personal or professional. So I think that was probably really cool for you to be a part of. So you're fortunate so I think most people probably know what an anesthesiologist is, but do you wanna just explain that, what your day in, day out work looks like?
Sure, I'd love to. You're right. I think people know that we exist, but not necessarily what we do. And yeah, especially patients that I talk to, they don't usually understand. So I can tell you that what I do is I see patients in the pre-op area, which is where I usually meet them for the first time, and talk to them, take their history, explain what I'm gonna do for them anesthesia-wise, and then take them back to the operating room.
I'm with them the entire time they're having their procedure done, doing whatever [00:08:00] anesthetic technique that we decided on was best for them. And then I'm with them all the way to the recovery room, where I drop them off with a recovery room nurse. And there I make sure that they don't have any pain or nausea or anything like that.
But it's funny, a lot of people, as part of my consent, I started telling people that I'm with you the whole time because I think people had the conception that we just take them to the operating room and leave them there and go drink coffee and read the newspaper and, do whatever. But real- in reality, we're there the whole time, and that's the-- we're-- that's where we do most of our work.
That's where we're watching blood pressure either every second or every couple minutes. We're watching how fast your heart's going, your oxygen levels, your breathing, a million different things, and making sure that everything goes okay. So we're primary care a little bit, or guardian angels, I like to say, in the operating room.
Yeah, for sure. I think if you've had a surgery, you know because you've met your anesthesiologist, but a lot of people are probably really anxious that pre-op area because You know, they've talked to their surgeon about what's gonna happen, and then they know that there's [00:09:00] probably this other person coming in, and then you are there, and it's like a pretty short little visit, and then they go back, right?
I-- we both know, and I'm sure lots of people do, there's definitely people who are just more business-like, I don't, I don't really wanna say like not a good bedside manner, but maybe just like we need to make this happen. It's gonna happen in the next ten minutes. Let's just get it in and out, like you said, just burst in the room kind of thing.
But I know that your manner is a little different than that. Do you wanna talk about that a little bit? Sure. I think that's kind of-- that's one of the greatest challenges of what we do. But I think it's also what I find most rewarding about what I do is 'cause, and especially in my position where I'm doing, you know, anesthesia for someone's heart surgery, where they're having a valve replaced or part of their aorta replaced or their coronary arteries bypassed, people are super nervous.
And here's this guy that they've never met, and I have five or ten minutes to get all the information I need, explain to them exactly what I'm gonna do and what's gonna happen, but also at the same time, make them [00:10:00] feel comfortable and make them feel like they can trust their lives in my hands, which is in a way what they're doing.
So and it's, the way that I approach and the way that I treat people has evolved a lot over time. But basically, I found that if you can find some common ground and make someone smile or laugh, then that goes a long way further than anything else I could do. Yeah, for sure.
We only worked together in really one capacity, right? 'Cause we met technically in the hospital. You were in med school still. I was working as a nurse, and then we never really took care of any patient together at the same time, except for one time at Children's Hospital. You remember?
I do. I would-- I would like to tell this story. Uh-huh. Yeah. So I was working as a nurse, and I was working a night shift. And I think you must have been there all day, or maybe you came in in the afternoon or something, and we were covering pain at Children's. And so many anesthesiologists specialize in pain.
And so as part of your training, you have to do that, so you understand that. And obviously, [00:11:00] that's a big part of any surgery too, right? And so I was coming in, and when nurses come into work, they get report. And so you find out who your patients are, and you get like a little report from the nurse who took care of them the shift before you.
And so this is the day nurse giving me the report on my patient, and it was a patient, she was a teenager and had had, Some sort of like surgery for I think osteosarcoma or something like that. And so she had an epidural in, which is many people think of it with having babies, but you also use epidurals and things for pain control.
And so we were sitting out in front of her room. Actually, first of all, in report, the nurse was like... 'Cause I was like how is her pain?" And the nurse was like, "Oh, that anesthesia resident's amazing. He's been up here multiple times. The mom requested that we call. He comes right up.
He's so nice," all this stuff. And I was like, "What does he look like?" And they were like, "Oh, he has, dark hair." And I was like, "Yeah, like a beard?" And they're like, "Yeah." I'm like, "That's my husband." So [00:12:00] that was pretty fun. I know what you're like, but to see you in action- ... and to hear about that was pretty neat.
'Cause then later, a few hours later, you came up to check on her again, and so we were sitting outside the room. And I'm sure, we're married, so the mom was kind of like, "Whoa, you guys know each other?" And just maybe the how close we were sitting together or something. I don't know. And I was like that's my husband."
She's like, "Oh, my gosh." So that was pretty fun. That's a good story. I like that story. It was a great story. So a lot of what we talk about on this podcast is it's called Harness Your Health for a reason, because I really try and make it very clear, I am not, again, Miss Medicine in any way, shape, or form, quite the opposite of that.
But I think in our culture and our society now, so many people are just suffering from These kind of things, symptoms, and conditions that medicine has a hard time putting in a box and knowing what to do with. And so people have really discovered that a lot of their [00:13:00] own habits, wellness things that they do day in and day out can really influence their health.
And so part of my mission with this podcast is helping people realize that, yes, you need your doctor. You're gonna have a surgery, you need a procedure, you need medications managed, whatever it is, you need that person or that provider. It's obviously very important. But a lot of the things you do, the way you eat, the way you, manage your stress, your movement, like all the things, those things matter so much for your health and to not discount them.
And so you have definitely had a journey with that too. Like I think back when we first met, I don't know if you would consider yourself like a runner, but you definitely ran. Like we would go running after I would get off work, right? Yeah. Or even when we moved to Denver, we would go running.
And so I, I always wanted to exercise for health reasons or to be completely honest, like weight control. You know, I was always taught or learned whether through [00:14:00] society or whatever, that it's like calories in, calories out. You gotta make sure everything balances or you're gonna gain weight and all of that.
So do you want to just speak to that? Like how has your view of health changed in the last twenty years or so? That's a good question. I think not specifically getting into the one thing that happened to you, but just in general? Yeah. I think just in general when you were a resident or a med student and we would go for a run I feel like the way we think about it is way different now than it was back then.
And maybe sometimes that's also like, our age, right? Definitely. And I think for, for sure, like you said, at first, like when I, when you're a student and when you're a resident, when you're super busy, you just kind of like everyone tells you, you need to get some exercise and more like punching the clock or just to get it done.
At least for me, I wasn't really trying. I didn't have any goals. I was just like, I'm gonna kinda get some exercise where I can, kinda try and squeeze it in. Mm-hmm. You know, Like you said, for whether it's for weight maintenance or just healthiness in general. At [00:15:00] that point, I didn't really realize all the health effects that it had, like how wide-reaching the health effects were.
I think I was more focused on like you said, I sit all day in an operating room and eat probably more than I should, and so this was a way to balance all that out instead of a way to like really further my health, if that makes sense. Yeah. That was really, I think, how the '90s early 2000s was.
There wasn't a lot of discussion about all of the health benefits of exercise. I have a degree in exercise science , so like even taking exercise physiology, those classes, like sure, it's talked about the like benefits, but I don't think any of that research or discussion really exploded until the last 20 years or so.
It's really changed drastically. And so I think it's really good for people, like I always ask them what your movement habits like. because I know like when our kids were really little, I didn't do a lot of really formal exercise because I was constantly running around [00:16:00] chasing after them.
Or if I was doing something, you were helping watch the kids so I could go for a run or do whatever. it doesn't always have to look like formal exercise. There are a lot of like prescriptions, if you will, for like you want to increase your VO2 max or you want to increase your flexibility or your strength, like you need to do these things.
And that is definitely true. But they have really shown that moving your body throughout the day is one of the best things you can do, and that connects so much to your entire body and how your entire body is connected. Yeah. I will say too that when I used to run a lot, like you said, and usually it was running on treadmills, sometimes outside, but I never really loved to run.
I never would look forward to going for a run or it was just like, like you said, something that we did because we were supposed to. And then when I found bike riding- Mm-hmm ... ... that's when exercise changed a lot for me. That's when like all of a sudden after a hard day at work, I couldn't wait to go for a bike ride or after when the kids were little and super busy, like sneaking away [00:17:00] for a few hours for a bike ride was like so therapeutic and so freeing and so great.
Yeah. I mean- That definitely changed my mentality towards exercise to finding something that I really love to do versus something that I was just doing because I thought I was supposed to. Yeah, absolutely. And, even your experience with biking has been different too, right? You definitely sometimes would like I signed up for this race," or, "My friend's gonna do it with me, so I need to ride for that or train for that."
And that's really changed a lot, especially in the last couple of years. So maybe we should just dive into that and talk about that. Do you wanna talk about the, elephant in the room? Not really elephant in the room, I guess, but, Maybe I'll just-- summarize it. So in May, really, of two thousand and twenty-three, You had a test done that was meant to be like a preventative test. Do you wanna talk about that? Sure, I'd love to. That's why we're here. Yeah. Uh, Yeah, so Yeah, I w- I had worked in private practice for a long time and been super busy and with little [00:18:00] kids and not really taking that much care of ourselves and myself, and I think yourself as well, Karis.
Like- ... we put our health as a second tier on the back burner. And so I got a new job that wasn't quite as busy. We'd been, like, starting to think more about longevity and health and what it means and that kind of stuff, and made decisions that we're gonna like, do what we can to improve our health as much as we can.
And so part of it was I decided to go get a calcium scan, which is a test that they do. It's a limited little CT scan of the chest that they do to look at your coronary arteries, and it can tell-- it can give an idea of whether or not you have coronary disease. And, I was, what, 47 at the time or something, and I wasn't really that worried that I had coronary disease.
But both of my grandparents had heart attacks in their 30s, both my grandfathers had heart attacks in their 30s, and both of them ended up dying of heart-related issues much later on, luckily. But so I thought-- and my dad doesn't really have any coronary disease, but I figured, it'd be a good idea just to get a baseline, see how I'm doing, all that kind of stuff.
And [00:19:00] so I got that test, I think it was May 15th of 2023. And then uh, the next day, I got a call from my primary care at the time, primary care nurse practitioner, and she said, the calcium score looks great, but they found a huge mass on the CT scan, and we need to get another CT scan and try and figure out what's going on."
And so know, my first question was like, "Is this common? Does this happen?" Is this do they have incidental findings? And it's automatically kicked into, physician mode and, it started a whole whirlwind of events that, Yeah ... that was pretty crazy.
Yeah. So I would just say first of all, getting actually diagnosed took three to four weeks of time, and some of that was just situational because it happened to be, over Memorial Day weekend. Some of that was me being in hyper stress mode. Not that I delayed it, but I thought that you had lymphoma because I've taken care of a lot of patients with heme malignancies, and that's often how they present.
They present 'cause they pass out, or they're doing some sort of exercise, and they [00:20:00] get really dizzy or whatever, and they go to the ER, and they g- have a big mass in their chest. So I'm like, "Oh, you have lymphoma." "I found a lymphoma specialist to take you to." So it wasn't that, but luckily they took good care of us and, and got you in for the biopsy, which is what you needed to get a real diagnosis.
But it was so strange for me, having taken care of so many patients with cancer, that now all of a sudden it's my husband dealing with this, and we were very lucky to have... One of my very good friends is a chest surgeon. Yeah. And so the first thing after I found out about this and talked to Karis, the next person I called was my good friend John, and I was like, "Hey, John."
And I, I didn't know if it was lymphoma or whatever. I figured it was something, though, just 'cause of how it looked- Yeah ... and everything. I said, "Hey, John. I think I'm gonna need to be your patient here." And he was amazing. He walked us through a lot of the workup and kept making sure that we were making forward progress and kept- Yeah
moving forward. I know. So it was... We were so lucky to have him- Yeah, for sure ... in our corner. Yeah. [00:21:00] So I would say one of the things that's really made us realize is us with our expertise... I was an oncology nurse. I'm very well-connected in oncology community. I know a lot of people all over Denver.
Those, some of those people helped to get us in to see the lymphoma subspecialist and things like that. Obviously we know John and are good friends with him. But it was hard for us and for you to get the formal diagnosis, so I think one of the things that we really have realized with this situation is that it was really hard for us. I'm an oncology nurse. I know a lot of people in the oncology space. I take care of a lot of patients. We - definitely used some of our connections to get in to see people to know what to do, and obviously with John's help, too, and it took us a long, long time to get diagnosed, and so it felt like forever at the time. It all felt- I was thinking about that the other day, is, it seemed like forever, I agree. Yeah. But at the same time, May 15th was my very first scan, and June 29th was my [00:22:00] surgery.
Yeah. So it was only like six weeks total, but I agree with you. 'Cause we had to fight with insurance about PET scans and- ... get different kinds of scans and then get insurance preapproval for surgery, and- Yeah ... it felt like such a struggle at the time, but I was thinking about this just the other day.
In truth, it was only six weeks- Yeah ... from the first scan to the surgery. Yeah, and I guess that's just a good testament to what it feels like when you're in that moment, right? And it's so scary, and you just want answers. I just remember thinking "I don't even care what this is.
We just need to know what is going on," yeah. 'Cause we go to Google, which is what everyone does, and myself included, and you type in chest mass- There's a lot of different things that come up, and we always would tell people, "Don't do that." But the reality is, is that people do do that because they're searching for information, right?
Yeah. And so you have to be careful about the information that's at your disposal, and then, like, where you go in your mind and what you do, right? 'Cause- ... you can have access [00:23:00] to the information and see all the different options, which is fine, but it's like you don't have to go there in your head and Make it like a- Yeah ... catastrophe. it's something like this ha- makes you stand still in a way that you almost can't even process the future. And so it's funny how that works, I think, at least for me. But then there's always points where you're looking ahead, right?
We know that too, based on what's happened. So do you wanna just talk about, so you had a big surgery at the end of June of that year. Do you wanna just talk about that? What treatment what the diagnosis ended up being? Sure. I will say that the the mnemonic for what a mass in your chest, where mine was- Uh-huh
could be what they've called is it, it's the terrible Ts, is how you remember, 'cause there's nothing good that is in there. So just to drive your point home of how scary it can be and- Yeah ... not knowing what's going on. So we saw through a friend, like through our very good friend John, we saw a wonderful oncologist too [00:24:00] named Ross, and met with them, and they decided that surgery would be the best thing, and that hopefully it would be curative.
the thymus is a gland in your chest that's really active when you're young. It creates a lot of your immune system, and then it kinda just shrivels up in most people and doesn't do anything else for the rest of your life, except for some people, it becomes cancer.
And so there's kinda two different kinds of cancer in the thymus. There's thymic carcinoma, which is kinda the more aggressive kind, and there's thymic carcinoid, which is the very rare kind that I ended up having, that usually isn't quite as aggressive. But we, and we knew that from a biopsy that I had gotten.
So the hope was surgery would be curative. We do have my friend John, luckily was also probably the best lung/chest surgeon, certainly in the state, if not in the country. So he, we're lucky enough to have him advocating for us and doing my surgery. And uh, had a, a thymectomy where they went through my chest.
They used a robot so that they didn't have to make a big sternotomy and cut my whole chest open to open it up. They were able to go through a much smaller incision with an easier recovery. And I think it was not an easy [00:25:00] surgery for John, at least he said-- he tells it that it's not. And there's been many beers bought as a thank you to him, but he did a wonderful job.
And, you know, I probably could have gone home that night. They kept me overnight. I had a chest tube. And I had a wonderful anesthesia team, too. Luckily, it was one of my residents was the anesthesiologist. I handpicked him, too, along with John's guidance, and he did a wonderful nerve block for me. Surgery went really well.
I spent one night in the hospital, went home the next day, and I think I took two total pain pills the whole time. And then the rest of the time my pain was under control with Tylenol and Advil. super lucky in that regard. Definitely. Maybe we should just back up, too, and say obviously, when you know someone who has these skills and can do this surgery, it's like we talk about in, the medicine world sometimes, like people will operate on their spouses or people will ca-take care of their spouses or their kids or whatever.
And I feel like everyone's line in the sand is a little bit different with that. you talked to John and were very upfront about "Hey, I get it if this is not something you wanna do [00:26:00] because we are good friends." But he-- I'm sure he gave it some thought, knowing him, right? And he was like, "No, this is something that I wanna do, and I, I can handle it."
Yeah, there's nothing more stressful than taking care of someone that you know, someone that asks you to take care of them. Yeah. And then with cancer too, it's even wor- worse, I'm sure, because it's you know what? If you don't get it all out or... where he's working, there's a lot of stuff that could be damaged.
There's a lot of bad things that can happen- Yeah ... doing surgery like that. And when it's your patient, it's different than when it's your friend who you ride bikes with and go to concerts with and have dinner with and stuff. It's so- Yeah. Yeah, I was very cognizant of that, and I told him. I was hoping that he wouldn't say no, because he's the best, and he's who I wanted.
But at the same time I don't wanna paint him into a corner where- Yeah ... he feels like he has to do it. So luckily- ... he was very gracious, and I'm sure he was super nervous. Well, When he came to meet with us, me and your mom and dad in the room. So you know, when you have a surgery, there's like, a little room off the waiting area where the family is waiting, and some staff member will come in and talk to the family once the patient [00:27:00] is done with the surgery and they're finishing things before they send him to the recovery area. And he laid his head down on the table. And I know he only did that because it was me and the... and h- your mom and dad. But it showed.
He was like, "That was really tough," you know? he was just expressing that the relief, I think, of that it went well. Yeah. But that it was really hard. And then, of course, he had to make a joke about how part of the tumor was up against your lung, and so he had to take out part of your lung, and so that he'll be faster than you on his bike from now on Which he is.
That was, his way of lightening the mood after like, a serious conversation too. But I think everybody has had healthcare people take care of them in some capacity where they really needed it, they needed that expertise. And, I think we're always grateful, but when it's something so serious like this , I think I was just so appreciative of every single person and their job.
I just remember being there in the [00:28:00] pre-op area, in the PACU area, and thinking about these different people who are working here and what they're doing and how they're taking care of people, and I don't think people really realize, I didn't even realize when I was working as a nurse I think, like, how important that work is and that how much it can really affect you, I know you get attached to people sometimes. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. That's what we get to. That's the humanness part of it, right? In oncology, that's very often what happens is we give someone their treatment over and over and over again to get to know them. You get to know their family, their daughter's in town, whatever, and it's just, like trying to make that experience the best it can be, just like you described in your pre-op.
The way that you approach it is you have five or ten minutes to help someone to ratchet down a couple notches, right? Yeah. It's really, really important. So I just wanna give a big shout-out to all the healthcare workers 'cause every person's job [00:29:00] is so important, and really does make a difference for how people get through these really serious, very stressful things.
So you had a surgery done, and then as often happens when you are diag-diagnosed with cancer, you go on a surveillance process, or, or you have some other treatment. Some people have surgery first and then they have chemo or radiation. But we were basically on the watch and wait, getting scans every so often.
Do you wanna just talk about that a little bit? just the following year or so, like what progressed after that? Oh, yeah. So when I had my initial, like the first CT scan, not the one for the coronaries, but the other one, there was also two lymph nodes that were enlarged as well.
When they did the surgery to take my thymus out, they took out one of the lymph nodes, not the other one. And so when I got my first scan, which was like, I think right after the first of the year, so about six months after surgery, the lymph node was still there, which led to a PET scan, and it showed that it was cancer too.
So led to another surgery with John helping out with another [00:30:00] surgeon whose specialty was doing stuff around... ' cause it was a little bit higher up in the neck. So with that guy who does, specializes with surgery in the neck, so the two of them took out that lymph node too. So I think that was in May as well.
That was like early May- Hmm ... though, 'cause they wanted to do it on Jackson's birthday, but we said no. That's right. Yeah. So that was like almost a year later we ended up taking that out. Yep. And so then back on the surveillance, having scans. And you mentioned that your cancer was more of a slow-growing cancer.
The thing with pathology is when they take tumors out and they're looking at them sometimes it's straightforward, and sometimes it's not. The other thing that we did in this process is we went to the Mayo Clinic. So I'll just mention here, when you're doing research and looking for things, the internet is wonderful, and it can connect you with people.
And we found this guy named Mike Delaney, who had had thymic carcinoma, and he had pretty extensive disease, or a lot more extensive than you had. Because most people who are diagnosed with this cancer don't-- it doesn't get [00:31:00] discovered until they have other symptoms or some kind of major thing happens.
And so Mike had started this group called the Thymic Carcinoma, I think it's Society or something. And basically, it has a Facebook page. and just reached out to him, and I was just like, "Hey, my husband just got diagnosed with this. I don't know what exactly you do, but we're just lost."
I've never-- I've taken care of cancer patients for a long time. I've never heard of this, or maybe one person, and so he was amazing and is really doing a lot of work to raise money for further research, because that's one of the hardest things about this kind of rare form of cancer is there aren't really established treatments, and people don't often think about that. They think, it sucks to get diagnosed with cancer no matter what cancer it is. But at least if you have HER2-positive breast cancer, there's an entire treatment strategy for that, right? Based on your staging and all the things. And so for your cancer, there wasn't a lot of information.
There was not a lot of [00:32:00] specialists, definitely not in Denver. Our oncologist was great, and your team was great at university. But we went to the Mayo Clinic do you want to just talk about that? Which a lot of people do for specialty things or second opinions. And that was at the advice of Mike.
He suggested that we get a second opinion and talk to someone who has seen more of these cases, seen more of the treatments, and just so that we can understand things a little bit better. Yeah, Mayo's pretty-- It's a very spectacular place. It's like a little city in and of itself. And we were lucky enough to see one of the experts in that field, I think there.
Dr. Mansfield was awesome too. we were blessed from beginning to end to have so many wonderful doctors and stuff. And so we got to go, met with him, and he I think the problem was, like, when they took that second lymph node out, they weren't sure if it had grown through the lymph node into the surrounding is-tissues or- or if it was contained and which makes a big difference for treatment. And it's, it's not always as black and white as it seems like it should be, especially- Yeah ... for the more kinda weird, rare [00:33:00] cancers like I had. And so we-- They-- Mayo looked at all the scans, all-- They actually got the pathology.
They got the slides and everything and looked at it themselves. And he thought that it looked like it was all contained and just continued surveillance. Yeah, he was wonderful. They spent hours with us, right? Obviously we traveled up there, but that was really, in my mind, just so helpful to talk to someone who is like, "No, I've seen this before.
This is what we see." And obviously it's not always cut and dry. It's not black and white. But having him... And you could go back and see him again if you needed right? Yeah. Hopefully we'll never need to do that, but it's just so nice knowing that you have these people for me too, I think that was, like, one of the scariest moments too because you hear about people that are going to these huge regional centers as a first, second opinion for cancer, and you never think it'll be you . You hope it'll never be you, and you think that "If I do get something, hopefully it'll be straightforward and easy."
And here I was flying to Rochester, Minnesota to like, see a specialist for some crazy thing that I didn't [00:34:00] really know- what was going on, and you have a strong family history of prostate cancer too, and so we always had that on our radar. Like, when should you start your prostate surveillance, like the blood test and all of that.
So this was, like, not on the radar at all No ... which is how things happen sometimes. Yep. It's how they happen a lot of times. I would say the first year or so of dealing with all of this, going through the surveillance, having the scans, scan anxiety is a true thing. People talk about it being anxious, and it makes sense before you have a scan.
I mean, We will both attest that that is a real thing. I think we definitely had some good health practices in place. Obviously I've had my practice going for a long time. But there's something about a huge stressor that kind of in some ways makes things fall apart and in other ways brings it all back together too.
So I think way I look at it is you had this big chest surgery. You couldn't get in water for [00:35:00] six weeks, right? So you couldn't get in the pool, in the hot tub, none of that, which is a bummer 'cause that's therapeutic, right? And it's s- it was summer too.
We're going on a beach vacation ... or the ocean. You couldn't get in the ocean, right? So that's just a bummer. I think there was just definitely things that just make it like, it's not the end of the world, but it's also this really sucks, and you couldn't really ride your bike the way you wanted to.
I still remember when you went on your first bike ride. And it wasn't against doctor's advice, but I think the advice was like, "Take it easy," "don't go anywhere crazy." No riding up North Table Mountain or whatever. And I don't remember exactly what you did. I just remember that I got a text from John, your surgeon when he saw it pop up on Strava that you had gone for a bike ride.
I think I titled it, "Sorry, John," or something like that. But, you needed that. You... That... At that point, biking was such a huge part of your life. You had been doing it for so long, and it was very therapeutic in nature. [00:36:00] But I think that it's really changed for you in the last couple of years, like biking in particular, and I think also when you get to the age that we are, you do start thinking about longevity.
You already mentioned that. But do you wanna just speak to, like, how your health habits have changed in your mind? Your health habits are not all really that different than they were before. I mean, In some ways they are, but I think the way you look at them has definitely changed.
Yeah, I would agree 100%. First of all, I think I wanna take it just a step back and say especially for the riding my bike thing, when you get diagnosed with something like cancer, what I've been thinking about a lot obviously, and when you have surgeries and procedures, I totally understand that, like, why people are so anxious to get back to their life, 'cause it's your way of saying "Everything's fine.
Everything's gonna be okay." So the sooner I could go back to work, I think I only missed a week of work, plus three days from when I had my huge chest surgery. I only missed a week of work when I had my other surgery, and the quicker you can go back to your normal life, the quicker you're [00:37:00] telling fate, "Hey, I'm gonna be okay.
Everything's gonna be fine." And that's part of the reason I wanted to ride my bike sooner too just to say, "Hey, everything's gonna be okay. I'm gonna survive this. It's gonna be great." But, and as for health habits, I think it became more formalized for me after this. Before, I had an idea of what I wanted or, I'd been training for certain rides or whatever.
I always needed that pressure of training for something or that, like that motivation, of training for something to get out there and exercise a lot. It was more piecemeal after, going through this and realizing, how things could change or, or how things were gonna be different, it, became just a more formalized thing where now I sit down every month and make a calendar, and I try and, lift twice every week.
Or I, I do lift twice every week. That's the goal. I meditate every day. Since the beginning of the year, I've been doing yoga almost every day, not every day. I put it on the calendar with my call schedule and my work schedule just to make sure I have time to get all the things done that I need to do.
And so it's not as-- It's not totally written in stone because my job's very fluid, and [00:38:00] so there has to be some fluidity to it. But at least I know that I'm gonna have everything scheduled I wanna do that week. And so if I can move stuff around within that week, I can get it all done, all the things I need to do.
We also started doing cold plunge and sauna. We made a lot of we re-remodeled our bathroom and put a cold plunge and a sauna in there. We made a lot of decisions that were like we're gonna be more health-centered going forward. We're gonna make that a priority. Yeah. And in a holistic way, you know? I feel like there's so many things you can do. You can stick with a rigid schedule, but if you're just really feeling trash from the week or you've been on call, you've been up all night doing a case or whatever, you might not be able to do the 50-mile bike ride the next day that you had planned, so it's also reminding yourself that you're gonna do something, right? 'Cause what I remember before, like 10 or so years ago, is if you were up all night and you didn't, you just wouldn't do the ride at all, right? It would just be like, "I can't do that, so I'm not doing anything." And now I [00:39:00] think you just have this beautiful way of "Yeah, I'm super tired, but I'm gonna go for a bike ride with my son," or, "I'm gonna do yoga," or, "I'm gonna get in the sauna," right?
Yeah. Do an e-bike ride. Yeah, exactly. And so it's definitely the mentality of that has changed rather than black and white, it's made it more fluid, and I think you feel more control of that. And so when you look back at the month, you know, there might be days that totally fell apart because of your schedule and your life the way that it is from that standpoint, but you still if you look at the whole month, you're like, "I did all of these things."
And that's why I love your calendar. It's literally just a piece of paper with a bunch of check marks. Yeah. It's as low-tech as it gets. It's from being an intern, you learn that when you have tasks to do, you put a little checkbox. You write the task out, and when you check that you do it, check it off when you do it.
Yeah. It makes you feel like you accomplished something. Yeah. It's whatever system works for you, right? Everybody's system has to be a little bit different. But you start a system, you use it consistently, [00:40:00] and then you decide "Is this what works for me?" And this is just your system, I think the other great thing that I did is I schedule rest days now, too. Oh. I don't feel guilty if I have even if it's a weekend, if it's scheduled as a rest day, even if I have time to do some, like a big bike ride or something, I don't feel guilty about taking a rest day. Yeah. That is true.
It's super important. For sure. And, a lot of people I see just push through when they're just super depleted and not feeling very good. And the rest day is almost like the swear word, it's like you don't even bring it up. It's like the same category as taking away their wine, their coffee, or their rest day, implementing a rest day.
So- Yeah ... I love that, that you brought that up. That's definitely a good point. So what do you feel like moving forward? Because you have a scan coming up, in a few weeks. I mean, you've been meditating for a long time. You've been meditating even prior to when this happened.
I don't even remember when you started meditating. When did that start? I don't know. It's been a long time ago. [00:41:00] Yeah. I think it certainly was nice to have when I was going through, especially the initial stages when I wasn't sure how things were gonna go. I wasn't sure how serious this, this was gonna end up being or what was gonna happen.
It was very helpful then. Yeah. I guess we left out the radiation. So you had the second surgery in May of '24, and then of spring of '25 they went in with the radiation to go after that lymph node, a couple lymph nodes. Just one. Just one that you had in your chest, you've definitely had this kind of path of like surveillance and some treatment and, I think it can feel, at least for me, I just describe it as a rollercoaster.
It's like you get the treatment done, you're feeling good, and you're on this high, and you ride that for a little while, and then the scan is coming or whatever the next thing is. And so then you get anxious, like coming towards that. That happens. Whatever happens with that, then you like, " Okay, now this is what you need to do."
Or I think one of the best things [00:42:00] was, was it in September of last year when you had something that was on your scan that had been there for a while but hadn't grown and you were like, "Hey, can we push this out a little bit?" Like you advocated for that. Yeah. Yeah. Like how did that make you feel?
Because I think what I would say from taking care of cancer patients is the, the common thread is that people feel outta control. They feel like they don't have control over this, whatever's happening, and they have to do this treatment or they... they don't ever have to, it's always your choice, but like it's recommended and it derails their life.
It derails their plans. And I think that's the hardest thing for people. And one of the reasons I think that like harnessing your health and taking control in the way that you can is helpful. But what would you say? No, I agree 100%. I think, by the very nature of this, when there's something like this happens, you're completely outta control.
And you can do little things to try and control it, but in the [00:43:00] end of the day, you have zero control. And I, definitely still have a lot of anxiety before scans. I'm starting to feel the scanxiety now. And in the past, definitely before all this stuff happened, but at the beginning of this too, like the way that I would deal with anxiety is by not taking care of myself, by eating, comfort food, sitting around doing nothing, not exercising, just kinda being- And I wouldn't say depressed, but just not doing anything.
And so I've been trying to change that now when I feel that feeling. Instead of eating a bag of chips, I've been trying to go exercise or get in the sauna or do something that's more beneficial. Yeah. And it sounds silly, like your sau- that singular sauna session isn't gonna take control over the situation the way it is taking control is because you made the decision to do that, and that's a different, healthier decision than sitting on the couch watching TV or eating the chips or whatever.
Yep, exactly. Or even going for an easy bike ride or taking our dog for a walk, it's like- Yeah ... it's at least doing something positive instead of just sitting there waiting for whatever's gonna [00:44:00] happen to happen. 'Cause whatever's gonna happen is gonna happen no matter what I do. So I can either be in the best shape that I can for it and be ready to meet it or celebrate hopefully nothing more needed to be done, or you can just get sit on the couch and waste away.
Yeah. And that's not, that's not how I wanna be. I wanna be proactive and healthy. In 10 years when this is all way behind us and I'm gonna be grateful for this time that I used it to springboard to being a better person in better health and- Yeah ... and I would say not even just the health-wise stuff, but I feel like family-wise too, I feel like- Mm-hmm
you know, before I worked a lot and I was tired. And when I was home sometimes I was on the phone talking about work or, you know, in our room watching TV on my phone, things like that. And I feel like this has just made me so much more appreciative of the time that I have, and I feel like I'm more present and with doing stuff with the family more, you know- Yeah
being around more than I was before. For sure. Which I'm not sure, I'm not sure that would've... it would've happened at some point probably, but I don't know if it would've happened as drastically as it did without- Yeah ... all this stuff going on. Yeah. You [00:45:00] definitely voiced that that is something that was, like, really in your mind and noticeable.
And I think a little bit too because of the age of our kids, or the age our kids were at when this happened, and they were more, a little more independent and obviously a lot more independent now. They're 15 and 16. And so you see them becoming more independent and less time with them, and so it also makes you at least it does for me, I'm just like, "Oh, I need to this conversation that I have with them in the kitchen is my way to interact with them today," absolutely. I think, not to get too heavy, but like when you look at your own mortality and thinking about maybe I only have a couple years left, and you think about what's my legacy gonna be? Like, how are my kids gonna remember me? How is my wife gonna remember me? I don't want it to be like, " Yeah, he worked a lot, and then he came home and sat on his phone in the, in his room," or "He worked a lot, and then he came home and just went for a bike ride and didn't really interact," or, like- ... I didn't want that to be my legacy either. Yeah, for sure. So hopefully I have more than just a few years, [00:46:00] but I feel like things are way different than they were. It's, we're coming up on three years.
I guess we just hit three years. Yeah. We're past three years now, just past three years since all this stuff happened, and- ... as much hardness and, heartache and stuff as it's been, it's also, I think we've used it as a positive thing, like- Yeah ... to improve ourselves, improve our health, improve our relationships, improve our lives.
Yeah, absolutely. I would agree with that wholeheartedly. Is there anything else you want to say, or do you feel like, what if someone listening to this has received a scary diagnosis or has been going through something like this kind of a rollercoaster, what would you say to them?
I would say that it's super scary, and it's, it's advice that I got a lot too, and sometimes it's hard, sometimes it's easy, but every day is a gift, and you need to treat every day like a gift. And that's true whether you've had a scary diagnosis or not, 'cause we're all one doctor's trip away from a scary diagnosis.
I was having no symptoms. I had no idea that anything was going on with me at all. Yeah. And I went in [00:47:00] and got this life-changing event. So I think especially if you have a diagnosis... And, our oncologist, his advice or his philosophy was like, if you have 90 days between scans, then do something for 90 days.
Make those 90 days. Do something you never would've done. Take guitar lessons or learn to sing or, you know, run a half marathon or a 10K or a 5K. Use the time that you have left because, you know, especially if it's a limited amount of time that you have left, you don't wanna waste any second of it.
Yeah. Which it's hard. It's, it's easier said than done, and certainly sometimes I do it better than other times. But really truly just treat every day as a gift to be grateful for every moment that you have. Yeah, 100%. Even, even the ones that aren't so great at the time. that's true. Sometimes you do have those...
We all have those days, right? And the, that's the beauty of a day is that the day's over, and you get a fresh new day the next day. Yeah. there's always little silver linings. Our boys are really funny, and you're really funny, so we have a lot of laughs about different things. And I think laughter very therapeutic Definitely. I wanna think about the things that we've done in the last three years. We were talking about this the other [00:48:00] night. We've done a lot of really cool things- Yeah ... in the last three years. True. That maybe we would've done or maybe not, but we did them, so that's what counts.
Yeah, experiences for sure. Yeah, we have done like, a Christmas trip where we give our kids a trip for Christmas instead of buying them presents. They still get some presents, but, it was started as less materialism and less stuff, and the joke about the trip is the trip is way more expensive than the stuff would cost.
A lot. But they have been talking about this. We've been doing this for probably at least 10 years, right? Maybe even longer. I think 10. Yeah. And so the kids always talk about the trip. They love the trip. They remember the trips. So we've started doing this even more. Our 16-year-old, when he turned 16, we went on a trip, right?
Yep. For Jackson's birthday, we got him an experience, instead of buying him another device or another whatever, we've really tried to lean into that too, and I think that that has been such a good example for [00:49:00] them to remember that those material things don't matter, and with experiences, you always have those memories.
And, like you said, we never know, like, how long any of us have, and so having those experiences and those memories is, is something that you can't... No one can take that away from you. It's always gonna be there. Yeah. That's what it's all about. Yeah, for sure. Well, Thank you so much for being here.
Obviously this is a special interest episode, but definitely one we wanted to put out there. And obviously you're a very special guest to me, so- Okay ... thank you for being here and sharing all that. I know it's not easy to always talk about that stuff and all these serious things, but I think that's also very therapeutic too.
Yeah, absolutely. I appreciate you having me on. Of course. All right. Have a good day, everyone.
What I hope you take away from this conversation is that taking care of your health doesn't require a diagnosis to get started, but sometimes it takes one to finally make it non-negotiable.
Jimmy's story is a [00:50:00] reminder that we are all, as he puts it, one doctor's visit away from life-changing news, and the way we live in between those moments matters deeply. This is exactly why I talk about the foundations on this podcast. Movement, rest, nervous system regulation, and mindset are all a part of this.
Not because they guarantee a perfect outcome, but because they keep you in the driver's seat of your own life, even when so much feels out of control. There's no guest link or resource to share today, just an invitation. If this episode resonated with you, if you're in a season of uncertainty, or if you've been putting your health on the back burner, I'd encourage you to take my Health Foundations assessment.
It's a great first step to understanding where to focus your energy. You'll find the link in the show notes. And if this episode meant something to you, please share it with someone who needs to hear it. These are the conversations that remind us what really matters. As always, your body isn't broken. [00:51:00] It just needs the right support in the right order, and sometimes it just needs you to show up for it.
See you next time
The information shared on this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and should not be considered medical advice. I am not a medical doctor, and this content is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Please consult with a qualified healthcare professional before making any decisions related to your health, especially if you have a medical condition or are taking medications
